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Stormtrooper/Clonetrooper marksmanship

 
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DamBuster617



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Location: Only Halfway to Everywhere

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:04 am    Post subject: Stormtrooper/Clonetrooper marksmanship Reply with quote

Hi gang. Anyone else pondered this line from Ep IV?

"And these blast points, too accurate for Sandpeople. Only Imperial stormtroopers are so precise." Rolling Eyes

Can anyone come up with an example from the OT of precise stormie shooting? I'm curious to see if the clones in Ep III are Ok shots like in Ep II. As I remember Jango/Boba aren't crack shots w/ a blaster either. Or do you think the accuracy got worse when they started to clone more people than just Jango/Boba?

Your thoughts ladies and germs?
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SpaceManMort



Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Location: Norfolk, VA

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was a thread about this a long time ago, I don’t remember what the conclusion was though

What should have been said,

Obi wan: "And these blast points, too accurate for Sand people. Only Imperial storm troopers are so precise."
Luke: "what the hell have you been smoking Ben?"

Rolling Eyes
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TheTennisBallKid



Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Can anyone come up with an example from the OT of precise stormie shooting?

Try the opening scene on the Tantive IV, or on the Death Star where they manage not to hit the "escaping" rebels. I don't why such a fuss is made over this, they let them go so they could track them to their hidden fortress.



ttbk
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Eric the Half a Jedi
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Obi wan: "And these blast points, too accurate for Sand people. Only Imperial storm troopers are so precise."


Well, Obi-Wan clearly never sat in on my sophomore year chemistry class, when our teacher taught us the difference between accuracy and precision. Accuracy is how close something gets to the "correct" result, in this case a shot that hits exactly where aimed. Precision has to to with the ability to reproduce a particular result. So, the stormtroopers could indeed be precise, in that they keep missing the targets (like the Rebel Heroes) in the same fashion.

As for the "accuracy" portion of Obi-Wan's comment, I think some stray sand may be rattling around in his brain.
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Firespray
Hyperactive


Joined: 07 Feb 2005
Location: Southern California

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think its because after jango died, they couldnt clone him anymore and they couldnt find boba so after many years, they decided to stop cloning stormtroopers and started recruiting people, i believe thats why stormtroopers are bad shots because they arent like the clones
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Pepa Quin
The Falconer


Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Location: West of Chicago

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They could also be clones of clones, which would result in errors like hand-eye cooridination problems.
Ignoring the bad grammar from Obi (I've caught that, too Wink ) it does indeed seem like the only time we see Imperials with decent aim is on the Tantive IV, where at least they manage to kill some rebels (although they lose just as many stormies).
The only other time we see a rebel get shot is what... when Leia takes a hit in the shoulder? I can't remember if any rebels are shown being shot in the final battle.

I suppose the quazi-logical explination is that against normal people stormtroopers fare well, but against people with the Force on their side (our heroes, not just Luke and Leia) they have no chance?
Oi, that's stretching it, sorry....
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DamBuster617



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
Location: Only Halfway to Everywhere

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it is safe to say the Stormies suffer from the same lack of hand-eye coordination that all movie bad guys suffer from. Has anyone come up with or come across a nice scientific name to describe this terrible affliction? We need a telethon to raise money for some movie bad guy range time. Anyone know any "C"-celebs we could get for poster-people? Wink "For only 2 creds a day, we can help Goon #3 hit the broad side of a barn."
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AZTrooper0013
Grumpy Stormie


Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[groan] How many times must I explain this?....

Actually, ttbk hit the nail on the head, and it's been the same thing I've been saying for years.

I will take any one of you nay-sayers out to the shooting range, and I'll prove just how accurate we troopers really are.

But...It's funny that this came up because it's going to be my first segment on the PodCast show "The Dragon Page", which is a Sci-Fi/Fantasy based show here out of AZ.

If you want to learn more about the PodCast, or the Dragon Page show itself (which would be a good idea), just go to:
Dragon Page Radio Show
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Gaia



Joined: 13 Feb 2005
Location: France

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Stormtrooper/Clonetrooper marksmanship Reply with quote

DamBuster617 wrote:
"And these blast points, too accurate for Sandpeople. Only Imperial stormtroopers are so precise."

Can anyone come up with an example from the OT of precise stormie shooting?

You're searching in the wrong direction, man. Ben meant that Tusken were nearly blind and could miss a sandcrawler in a Deathstar corridor!
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ApophisV



Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUT they are able to shoot at pod racers?? Confused Thats weird.... Wink
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spotfrog



Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Location: Ft. Worth, TX

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there was a chance Ben was talking about how strategic the blast points were. Sandpeople would probably just keep hitting the sides of the sandcrawler, with no affect, while the stormtroopers might go for the tracks, and then break in. The jawas are pretty defenseless, so there's no reason the imperials couldn't just walk up and shoot the most vulnerable parts of the vehicle.
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michealearlwillard



Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Location: Kent, WA

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That was how I read it ... because as he says it I believe he gestures to where the treds on the sandcrawler were blasted. But as for shooting, try firing a gun with at a rapid rate and trying to hit a target the size of a person from say the distance of the chasm or some of the other ranges they are at (all though some are small, they are also often surprised by the heros). Now imagine shooting with one of those helmets on "I can't see a thing in this." Plus there is the hero factor, and sure your could even throw in the reasoning that the Imperials troops were just trying to herd them around, rather than kill them.
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Repoort
Man of Many Reds


Joined: 06 Feb 2005
Location: California Status: Groovy

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Firespray wrote:
i think its because after jango died, they couldnt clone him anymore


I think that'd be highly unlikely. Here on Earth we have the technology to keep DNA around for hundreds of years if we wanted to. I see no reason why they would just throw it away after Jango died, seeing as they already has his consent.

Though I also don't understand why the Kaminoans would switch the host (says Lucas) when Jango was perfectly fine. Maybe it was just too expensive? Or should cost even be a factor? Ah, maybe that's why.

Perhaps Kamino's cloning facilities had run out of funds, due to the Empire, to continue the training and enhancement of the new-host clones. So that's why Stormtroopers seem to have bad aim.

Similar to TIE Fighters, one couldn't harm a flea but several thousand shooting in the same direction are bound to hit something.
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deathstickman



Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Location: Boston,MA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are you talking about? They shoot fine, if all the're aiming at is walls and princesses arms Razz .
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Gaia



Joined: 13 Feb 2005
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2005 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ApophisV wrote:
BUT they are able to shoot at pod racers?? Confused Thats weird.... Wink

YES BUT they were shooting at an OTHER pod racer!!! Wink
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fatespadawan



Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Location: Texas & California

PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2005 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always justified that line this way:

Vader sent officers down to find the droids. These guys weren't clones. That could explain why they shoot better than the others. Vader told the Imperial Officer to send a detachment down to retrieve the plans and to see to it personally.

Also, Obi-Wan has been on Tatooine 20 years and probably hasn't seen the new batch of troopers in action. He's used to seeing Jango's clones in action, not the idiot clones of clones of clones we see in ANH.

Or maybe....

Most the stormtroopers died when the first Death Star blew. The Empire had to fast-track a bunch of new troopers and skipped a lot of the training afforded to the Jango clones.

Or perhaps...

Luke did tell Han that "he couldn't see a thing" when he was wearing a stormtrooper helmet. Maybe that accounts for the bad aim.
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Eric the Half a Jedi
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a hard time believing that many stormtroopers would have the same problem Luke had with seeing out of the stormtrooper helmet. Chances are that Luke wasn't the same exact size of the stormtrooper whose armor he borrowed. I would imagine the Empire would provide slightly customized helmets and armor based on small differences in body size and head shape. Even if they have some strict tolerances about the various dimensions of one's head in order to make it to the level of stormtrooper, some minor variations could make it difficult for one to see out of anything but one's own helmet.

Plus, Leia commented that Luke was short for a stormtrooper, so I guess he wasn't big enough to wear the big boys' armor.
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Wedge



Joined: 27 Feb 2005
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't get it. The Stormtroopers couldn't shoot to save their live (and many didn't Wink ) but the pilots are excellent. How do you explain the heavy rebel pilot losses?
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RecluceMage



Joined: 22 Feb 2005
Location: Santa Rosa, CA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always thought the quote meant that any standing army will be better trained than locals.
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