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The Presidential Race (US)
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Zedsier
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:20 am    Post subject: The Presidential Race (US) Reply with quote

Well, it's going somewhere, and we might as well start talking now even if we have to wait for a year.

Discuss.
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Rs Conqueror
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm leaning away from Mitt Romney. In my state he was very shaky and didn't really do anything other then veto bills, only to have them overruled by the MA state senate a few days later. He also abandoned his LT governor when she was running for the governorship, so he could campaign for president.

I like Rudy Giuliani the most so far. He did a great job of cleaning up new york city, and his reaction during the 9/11 crisis was spot on, although I'm not sure where he stands on immigration, which is a big issue for me.

Clinton, although she's trying to appear more moderate, is still too far left for me. I don't like what she'd try to do with healthcare. (I already have no social security left, don't drain any more of my money on social programs).

Obama would be an interesting choice, but (and I'm totally stealing from Austin here) so far I don't the he has the legislative experience required for running the nation, come back in 4 years and we'll talk.

Honestly, I believe this whole presidential run will boil down to immigration. I don't think most US citizens want amnesty given to people who are here against the law, and I certainly don't think they want their tax dollars given away so that people who sneak in under the radar don't have to work.

Just my .02

There, I've tried to keep this post civil, lets see if everyone else who posts here can too.
~ Rs
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RebelZombie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rs Conqueror wrote:
so far I don't the he has the legislative experience required for running the nation, come back in 4 years and we'll talk.


Sorry but almost anybody is more qualified for the job than our current millionaire dictator.

Rs Conqueror wrote:
I don't think most US citizens want amnesty given to people who are here against the law, and I certainly don't think they want their tax dollars given away so that people who sneak in under the radar don't have to work.


Hmmm... interesting considering that all of the so called "founding fathers" of the U.S. were illegal invaders. I'm sure that the Native Americans thought of it as somewhat illegal when the Europeans started pillaging and stealing their land.

Besides, I'd rather my tax dollars go to moochers than where most of them go: military spending.

Everyone knows that spending billions on weapons of mass destruction actually helps people. Rolling Eyes



Please, no more political threads! I can't help but to post. Cool
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renegade
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't particularly care as long as Clinton doesn't get it. I have spent most of my life now living under the Bush / Clinton dynasties and they both suck. Gads, I can't believe we are even considering her.

As far as the rest, lame lame lame. 6 of one half a dozen of the other. On the other hand, considering most people considerable apathy about what is actually going on in this country, perhaps we are getting the dictatorship, er government we deserve.
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KungZombie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm tempted to root for Clinton just so we can all refer to Bill as the First Lady.

Other than that, I haven't started looking at the candidates, other than to say WOO AL FRANKEN IN MINNESOTA.
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RebelZombie
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KungFused wrote:
WOO AL FRANKEN IN MINNESOTA.


Yeah, thats pretty awesome. Unfortunately California is the bizarro version of Minnesota. They elect doofus celebrities like Arnold and Ronald Reagan.
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menono



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You want us to woo Al Franken?!?! What???
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Padawan716
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rudy Giuliani for president? Meh. He's banking solely on 9/11.
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bobskink



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

renegade wrote:
I don't particularly care as long as Clinton doesn't get it. I have spent most of my life now living under the Bush / Clinton dynasties and they both suck. Gads, I can't believe we are even considering her.

Tss tss, I belive the last 7 years were a lot worse than the 8 years before that.

Any chanse that Al Gore will come back on his dessision and still run for president, now that he's getting more popular and respected again. I think I speak for a lot of Europeans, that we want Al in the Oval office. We should even be allowed to vote, since the president of the USA is actualy the leader of the world.

(This topic will never have a happy end)
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ZombieAndi
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who is all in the race?
I only know that Clinton, Obama and Rudy Guiliani want to become President.
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Teg



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andi wrote:

I only know that Clinton, Obama and Rudy Guiliani want to become President.

There are tens of them you never heard about before... and probably won't.
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Big Z
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't say I'm really interested in ANYONE who's in the running right now. It's pretty disappointing.
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Faulconbridge



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RebelRock wrote:
KungFused wrote:
WOO AL FRANKEN IN MINNESOTA.


Yeah, thats pretty awesome. Unfortunately California is the bizarro version of Minnesota. They elect doofus celebrities like Arnold and Ronald Reagan.


Well, we (and I don't mean "I") did elect Jesse Ventura. Rolling Eyes

Franken intrigues me. I think he's a very interesting person who might do a lot to shake things up in DC. The big question is whether people will take him seriously. There might be too many Stuart Smalley flashbacks. But gosh darn it, people like him.

As for the presidential race, it's much too early. So I'm going to stick my fingers in my ears and go, "lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala" until the primaries are over and there's just one candidate from each party.
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timborino
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RebelRock wrote:
Rs Conqueror wrote:
so far I don't the he has the legislative experience required for running the nation, come back in 4 years and we'll talk.


Sorry but almost anybody is more qualified for the job than our current millionaire dictator.

Rs Conqueror wrote:
I don't think most US citizens want amnesty given to people who are here against the law, and I certainly don't think they want their tax dollars given away so that people who sneak in under the radar don't have to work.


Hmmm... interesting considering that all of the so called "founding fathers" of the U.S. were illegal invaders. I'm sure that the Native Americans thought of it as somewhat illegal when the Europeans started pillaging and stealing their land.

Besides, I'd rather my tax dollars go to moochers than where most of them go: military spending.


Ironically, I believe many/most of the founding fathers were of the opinion that it is the wealthy who should control politics, seeing as they had an interest in keeping the country running smoothly. Of course, that was also 200 years ago, so things have changed a bit.

Anyway, you're probably right about a majority of voting Americans wanting out of Iraq by now. In any case, I imagine all the money we're spending right now will just be redirected towards Iran and North Korea. The government is pretty terrible at getting its money back once it's been claimed by an organization.

As for candidates, I definitely echo the anti-Hilary sentiment. I don't trust her.

I guess the two people I'm most interested in watching this year would be Obama, first because of all the hype and second because it would be great to see some fresh blood in Washington, and second Guiliani. Sure, he may be banking on 9/11, but I'm sure he has a lot to offer besides that.
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bobthestormtrooper



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have nightmares about Hillary Clinton becoming president. At least she might split the democrat vote...
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Big Z
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Faulconbridge wrote:
Franken intrigues me. I think he's a very interesting person who might do a lot to shake things up in DC. The big question is whether people will take him seriously. There might be too many Stuart Smalley flashbacks. But gosh darn it, people like him.


Psh. I don't. Very Happy

Franken's a motivated man, no doubt about it. But I have an incredibly hard time seeing him getting anything done in office. Then again, as I said, I don't like him, so it's hard for me to have an unbiased opinion. Smile

Y'all are doing a good job, by the way. Keep this on track.
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Jargon



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had an interesting revelation a few weeks ago. I was listening to the radio, hearing the news anchors going on about "Obama did this," "Hilary said that," and "Giuliani announced" and I was pretty nonplussed. I have a fair interest in politics, but nothing really excited me about this election.

Then I sat straight up. I realized that, come 2008, I'd be voting in this election. You can be sure I'm paying more attention then ever now. Razz

One thing that bugs me is how everyone is going on and asking,
"Is America ready for a black president? Is America ready for a female president?"
As if we don't vote for either, that makes us prejudiced. I may be a white, European-descent, male, but I have no problem with a black, a female, or a black female president.

But that's not going to make my decision for me. What will make me cast my vote in a direction is how I feel about their stance on things. Not their skin color or gender. To me, that's almost reverse racism.
    - Aaron

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Big Z
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jake_Snicket wrote:
As if we don't vote for either, that makes us prejudiced. I may be a white, European-descent, male, but I have no problem with a black, a female, or a black female president.


Oprah for president! Wink
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Sully



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RebelRock wrote:
Besides, I'd rather my tax dollars go to moochers than where most of them go: military spending.


Well, Rocko, the reality is that more than half of your tax dollars goes towards entitlement programs or interest on them; Social Security and Medicare themselves account for approximately 53% of the federal budget. Make no mistake - the United States is very much a "welfare state" and will be for some time yet.

Another statistic: military spending as a portion of the federal budget is less than half of what it was during the heady days of the Cold War. True, we spend more than anyone other country on our military (by a huge margin, admittedly), but when we consider economies of scale, the amount we spend is fairly defensible. In the larger view, most budgetary debates are meaningless; since entitlement programs consume so much of our expenditures, we end up splitting hairs over dollar amounts that have no qualitative impact on our budget. Yes, $50 million for a "bridge to nowhere" in Alaska, or even $100 billion to fund the war in Iraq seem like a lot of money when considered out of context, but they are vanishingly small percentages of our total budget. Unfortunately, the reason such debates exist is so that politicians can portray themselves as fiduciarily responsible, but without having to make any truly hard decisions.

Cheers.
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Scitvs
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sully I think you've hit the nail on the head.

As for who I think I would vote for:

Not Clinton, no I'm not sexist, but I just have a hard time trusting someone who can't even tell her husband is having an affair, be in charge off a nation who's security is based largely on intelligence. Perhaps I just didn't like what her husband did. Perhaps I shouldn't judge her by that, but there's just something not right with me about her.

Guiliani, hmmm. It'd be interesting to see what he has to say, but I'm not sure if he's the guy I want to trust with our nation. Perhaps I'm too apathetic, I'm just not sure about him yet.

Issues I'd like to see dealt with:

As for the military spending issue; On top of what Sully said, I think that it's important to have a good solid funding for our armed forces. After all, times are changing. In a world of stealth fighters, space deployed marines (well very soon anyway), and information warfare, I think it's essential to keep up with the times. Learn the lessons of Rome. When you have the best equipment you can, when you put your mind to it, win. Lose the edge, and you get conquered and lose your power.

Immigration. A huge subject in this election. (or, so I would predict) What should be done? If we seal off the border, we look like exclusive, tyrannical snobs. If we keep them (relatively) open, we got flooded with illegals, which in turn messes around with the economy. I'm no politician, but I think we should definitely focus on this issue and get it resolved. There are many possible ways of fixing this, and some have not yet been explored.

Anyway, my two Denarii.
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ZombieSolo
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you all think about Kucinich ? He's a long shot, but I like most of his ideas on his "10 point plan..."
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Fett



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Three words..........................



















JUNSIER FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!! Razz


Now that would be interesting......

Really, I haven't been paying attention to the Presidential Race, but one thing I know: I do not want Clinton as a president. She will make a mess of everything. The main thing is that she wants to take everyones guns away Confused . Nuff said.







Fett


Go Junsier!
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renegade
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cello Collin wrote:


Y'all are doing a good job, by the way. Keep this on track.


hehehehe - That's because the only reasonably strong opinions to come out of it so far is that pretty much everyone running for either party sucks.

sully wrote:
Well, Rocko, the reality is that more than half of your tax dollars goes towards entitlement programs or interest on them; Social Security


One oft overlooked fact about Social Security is that if all the dollars extracted from our paychecks had actually been put into the SS fund and not been used to offset other portions of the federal budget to reduce the "look" of the size of the deficit the money would be there now and it wouldn't be heating up into the crunch that it is. While I personally am not a fan of the program or really any other of the ones run by the government, it is the government misuse and raiding of those funds for balancing past budgets that is really causing the scale of the looming SS impact on us.

__________________________

As an aside, I would like to revise a previous statement. I do want Hillary to get the nomination for the Dems. But only if Condi decides to run and gets the nod for the Republicans.

Then instead of an election we can have a big cat fight on the national mall. Perhaps fill the reflecting pool in front of the Washington monument with mud and have them go at it. First one to claw the eyes out of the other gets the Ovary Office. Yeah, a mud fight in front of a giant phallic symbol ought to do the trick. Wink
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bobthestormtrooper



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I reeeeaalllyyy hope you mean 'Oval Office', and that other thing was just a typo.
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renegade
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobthestormtrooper wrote:
I reeeeaalllyyy hope you mean 'Oval Office', and that other thing was just a typo.



Nope, I really actually meant exactly what I wrote. It was a satiric rif on a word variation designed to elicit a humorous response, a device often use in comedy.

But I was dead serious on the mud wrestling part. Smile
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ZombieSolo
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How progressive.
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bobthestormtrooper



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No racial discrimination when everyone's the color of mud!
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renegade
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobthestormtrooper wrote:
No racial discrimination when everyone's the color of mud!


hehehehe

See it will be just like every other election cycle.
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KirK Kanos



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just don't want Clinton to get elected, that's all.
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Scitvs
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DonSolo wrote:
What do you all think about Kucinich ? He's a long shot, but I like most of his ideas on his "10 point plan..."


Meh. I agree with some of his points, but others, like the universal health care, don't do it for me. I don't mind government run health care, but when it's forced on you I can see many problems with the system. Just look at the recent VA hospital news for my concerns. I mean we should leave it as an open option, but if it's forced, as in no decent privately run health care, I won't vote for it.

If, on the other hand, it's a viable and helpful option for those who lack funds, I'm all for it. However, some concern should be raised over abusers of the system, as we tax paying citizens shouldn't have to support leeches and those who simply don't try to stand on their own two feet. In short, I feel, that it should be open only to those who can't fend for themselves in the high priced health care world of today.

And that, is that. Again, my two Denarii.
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